Peter Boyles Show, John Sampson, June 5, 2012

Station:   630 AM, KHOW

Show:     Peter Boyles Show

Guest:     Sampson


Date:      June 5, 2012

Topics:    Birthers, The Denver Post, Curtis Hubbard, ProgressNow, Michael Huttner, Jason Salzman, Cory Voorhis, Barak Obama, Hawaii, Birth Certificate, Joe Arpaio, Mike Zullo, Social Security Number, Connecticut, Madeline Payne Dunham, Phil Wolf, Terry Lakin, Greg Hollister, Fulton County, Georgia, Judge Malihi

Click Here for Audio


HOST PETER BOYLES:  One of the things that Curtis “I-won’t-return-your-phone-calls” Hubbard… You know, and then, they do that all the time, and it’s… “oh, was not available for comment.”  I guess Curtis Hubbard was not available for comment.  But he takes the top five birthers.  And he makes me number one and I don’t deserve number one.  Terry Lakin, Phil Wolf, Greg Hollister, and John Sampson all risked light years more than I did.  I risked nothing.  They risked everything.  Without further ado, this man was number five on the list.  He’s been a great friend for us.  He’s been a friend .. more than a friend to Cory Vorhis through those fights. He’s always stayed with us.  His name is John Sampson, and let me read what Curt Hubbard wrote.  “Number five, John Sampson.  As blogger Jason Salzman…”  First of all, John, did you get a big kick of him using Jason Salzman  using him as the ax to swing at your tree?

JOHN SAMPSON:  Good morning, Peter.  And yes, I did.  Mr. Salzman and I have spoken on a couple of occasions, and it is what it is, but yeah, I got a kick out of it.

BOYLES:  What I thought was interesting is Salzman,…. Although yesterday, in a private conversation, Salzman called and I have, you know, obviously, spoken about the contest that had no winner.

SAMPSON:  mm-hmm

BOYLES:  The one that he ran with Michael Huttner.


BOYLES:  And so yesterday when he called me he wouldn’t answer any direct questions.  But he did say to me it was Huttner and ProgressNow who ran that contest, not him.


BOYLES:  Ahhh.  So he is not responsible for the contest without a winner, but it’s ProgressNow who has been out lampooning all kinds of good conservative issues.  Well, he said it was ProgressNow, so I take him at his word, that it was Michael “In-hiding” Huttner and the hard-hitting bunch of stalker girlfriends at ProgressNow, so, here we go…

SAMPSON:  [inaudible]

BOYLES:  I’m sorry, go ahead, sir.

SAMPSON:  It’s been interesting, I’ve got to say that.

BOYLES:  Yeah, so let me read it to you. [reading from newspaper op-ed] “As blogger Jason Salzman recently wrote, Sampson is a retired immigration officer who claims Obama has been using a Social Security number issued to a Connecticut resident in 1977.”  End of story.  That’s all he writes.  All right.  Who is the owner of SSN 042-68-44 …  Let me go back.  First of all, give me a career overview so people know who you are.

SAMPSON:  Well, let’s see.  I retired from Immigration and Customs Enforcement in August of 2008, after 27 plus fun-filled years working in Immigration Enforcement.  Before that I was a police officer in New York.  Like Colonel Lakin and Colonel Hollister, I am a veteran of the Armed Forces of the United States, having served in the first Gulf War in the Coast Guard Port Security Unit.  And currently, as you know, I’m a candidate for the Colorado State Senate in Adams County.

BOYLES:  How did you… How … When we went into the Voorhis fight, and you never missed a day in court, we sat together

SAMPSON:  Well, actually, yeah, I was in court everyday.  But unfortunately myself and another ICE agent were  sequestered in what I euphemistically refer to as the “green room”

BOYLES:  Yeah, the bull pen… [chuckles]

SAMPSON:  … because we were potential witnesses and when the first witness that the defense called Gray Buckley who’s retired from the Deputy Director from the Colorado Bureau of Investigator did his outstanding job on the witness stand, we were told our presence wasn’t needed on the witness stand and they brought us back in.  But yeah, I was with you that day when the jury came in.

BOYLES:  Having said that, what would you like to say about that story – about Voorhis and ….

SAMPSON:  You know, it was a very unfortunate situation.  Cory did the right thing in that he, like myself took an oath to support and defend the constitution of the United States.  And last night, I was at the Lincoln Day dinner where Colonel West, or Congressman West was keynote speaker.  And Congressman West when he was stumping in Florida had made a comment that we all took an oath and that oath didn’t come with a statute of limitations.  And I know for a fact that Cory and Mike Rebile and myself took that oath and take that oath very seriously.  And just because we don’t wear the suit anymore doesn’t necessarily mean that we don’t serve any longer.  Cory fortunately has landed on his feet.

BOYLES:  Yes, he has.

SAMPSON:  He is the … I believe he is the director of Loss Prevention for one of the supermarket chains here in Colorado.

BOYLES:  Yes, he is. Yes, he is.

SAMPSON:  You know, it’s a little scary what the government can do to you

BOYLES:  But you know, when we were discussing the Voorhis case the other morning and I’ve discussed it with so many people privately, you think about it, the principals…. Ritter is in shame and tapped out.  Stephanie Villafuerte, “hair-dryer”, “blow-dryer” has gone on to be a flak master for Michael Hancock and spin those lies like he [sic] spun them for Ritter.  Lepley resigned.  Morrisey I hope to God runs for re-election.  I hope to God he runs for re-election.  Kimbrough – we make an award of, for Kimbrough.
Trey Rogers, all these guys, what happened to them?  They’re in the weeds.  Who stands tall?  Voorhis does.  Now, did he lose his career, John?

SAMPSON:  Absolutely

BOYLES:  You’re absolutely right.  But you know what?  The rest…  Look at the rest of them.  Look at the people who were surrounding and attacking Voorhis.  Look at where they are.  And then look at Voorhis.  I’d rather be Voorhis.

SAMPSON:  That’s correct.  He paid a heavy price, but …

BOYLES:  Yes, he did.

SAMPSON:  …but he can look himself in the eye and [inaudible] himself in the mirror

BOYLES:  And I know Bill Ritter can’t.  I think… I wonder if Lepley… Well, Lepley probably can.  Cantwell… who knows about what the CBI people did, but Cantwell was there at the time. And you know, in my mind they live in disgrace.

SAMPSON:  I agree with you.

BOYLES:  Having said that…


BOYLES:  … where did you get onto this 042-68-4425 SSN?

SAMPSON:  Oddly enough, Cory and I had gone back to Illinois back in November of 2009 for a convention, if you would.  And at that convention, I had the opportunity to meet Orly Taitz, who has been derisively refered to as “the Queen of Birthers”.  And she asked me when she heard what my credentials were if I would be willing to work for her and run down a particular Social Security Number, which turned out to be 042-68-4425. And I agreed to do so and all I did was run it through the databases that I would use for my consulting firm and came up with all the information that that number related to, or was being used by Mr. Obama.  And that the number had been issued sometime between the period of 1976 and 1977 to somebody who was residing at that time in the state of Connecticut.  Further research indicated … we narrowed it down because we ran the number immediately preceding the one Mr. Obama was using and the one that was immediately following the one that Mr. Obama was using, and one of the two turned out to be an individual by the name of Thomas Wood, who was deceased.  And we were able to get the SS-5 which is the Social Security application for the number.  That number was issued in Connecticut … or to Mr. Wood who was living in Connecticut and it was in March of 1977.  So we had a starting point where we could narrow it down in time as to when that number was issued.  As far as my knowledge is concerned, Peter, I don’t know who is the rightful owner of 042-68-4425, because the Social Security Administration is refusing to release that information.  And that is the sum and substance of how I came to be involved in this situation.  Since then, I was called to testify in Georgia, in Fulton County, in front of Judge Malihi back in January of this year, and we all know how that wound up.

BOYLES:  And that was the bizarre one.  That’s when the President and his attorneys, they ignored any and all subpoenas.

SAMPSON:  Correct. And that’s when the Secretary of State issued his infamous letter that if you failed to participate, you do so at your own peril.

BOYLES:  But then, they spend a long weekend and almost like the Pat Sullivan sentencing, everybody comes out with a smile on their face and it all ends!

SAMPSON:  That’s correct.

BOYLES:  That’s crazy!

SAMPSON:  Ultimately, he was … In fact, just before the hearing started, they had an in-chambers session.

BOYLES:  Yeah, I know.

SAMPSON:  And from what I had been told, the judge was indicating clearly, unequivocally, that he was going to issue a default judgment ….

SAMPSON:  BOYLES:  Yes, against…

SAMPSON:  … against Mr. Obama.

BOYLES:  Yeah.

SAMPSON:   Unfortunately, it didn’t turn out that way.

BOYLES:  And no one knew why!

SAMPSON:  No, everybody can guess but…


SAMPSON:  … you know, or draw their own conclusions.  But nobody knows for certain why that happened.  I mean, I’ve read that decision and had Mr. Obama shown up, that would have been a decision that could have possibly been argued either direction.  But the fact of the matter is, he failed to appear.  And, um …

BOYLES:  [laughing]  Yes!  And he ignored the subpoena

SAMPSON:  Yes.  It’s been an interesting ride, to say the least.

BOYLES:  Let me take a break and come back.  Now, when there’s not answers to questions, it always begs some sort of an answer.

SAMPSON:  Correct.

BOYLES:  And so, if we talk about Mr. Ludwig and where he died, it may begin to explain this.  But for the people who say that this was just a mistake by a number or two numbers, that Barak Obama using a Connecticut SSN was simply a mistake by the Social Security offices in Hawaii, how do you respond to that, John?

SAMPSON:  That’s … you know, we’ve torn that apart and looked at it, and I’d say that the odds of that being a mistake are about on a par with me winning the Lotto.

BOYLES:  [chuckles] Yeah.  Right.  Exactly.

SAMPSON:  You know, that’s about the best way I can describe it.

BOYLES:  Hang on.  We’ll come back.  John Sampson is here.  Number five on the list.  Fifteen after seven, seven-fifteen

[commercial intermission]

BOYLES:  It’s twenty minutes after seven, seven-twenty. Good morning, everyone!  The big five birthers, with the exception of one, on the radio show this morning.  630 KHOW.  Tuesday. website:  What do you do when the Secret Service knocks on your door?  These people have a home video.  You can see that.  Chance for T-storms and eighty-seven degrees.  [commercial plug for]  Our guest in John Sampson, number five on the list doled out by The Denver Post as, I guess, the worst of the worth [inaudible?] – the Birthers.  So, we are talking that the president of the United States has an 042-68-4425 SSN.  And you say that there’s no way it could have been issued by the state of Hawaii.  Or…

SAMPSON:  Well, what I’m saying is that the records indicate that the number was issued in March of 1977 to someone who applied for that number while residing in the state of Connecticut.  And it wasn’t the clerical error, it wasn’t transpositional error that it magically found its way to Hawaii by accident.

BOYLES:  Madeline Payne Dunham, known as ‘Toot’, Barak Obama’s grandma, who raised him,…

SAMPSON:  Correct.

BOYLES:  Now, she worked part time in a probate office in the Honolulu, Hawaii courthouse.  And according to some investigators, that therefore had access to the SSNs of deceased individuals.  Is that possible to do?  And, when you file taxes, John, what happens?

SAMPSON:  I’m not sure I’m understanding.  When you file taxes, your Social Security Number is sitting on the top of the tax return.  I mean, if that’s where you’re going with …

BOYLES:  Yeah.  How long has the President had the 042?

SAMPSON:  How long has he had it?


SAMPSON:  I don’t know.  I would say that the number was issued, as I said, in March 1977.

BOYLES:  We’re led to believe that he’s working in an ice cream shop.  Right?

SAMPSON:  Well, he’s working in an ice cream shop, but that was prior to the number being issued.   So, the question is, how … what number did he use when he was working in the ice cream shop, assuming he used one to begin with?  You know, the … Mr. Ludwig died in June of 1981, according to what I’m looking at right now, at the ripe age of ninety-one years, three months.  He was born in February of 1890.  I have not seen, Peter, any direct indication what number Mr. Ludwig actually had.  I do know that it begins with 042, but I don’t know myself, whether or not that’s the number in question.  The other thing is what you’ve mentioned is the Selective Service record, which is also extremely problematic.  In March of this year, I had the opportunity to be flown down to Phoenix, Arizona for a day-long meeting with a group of individuals who includes Joe Arpaio, Mike Zullo who is the lead investigator for Cold Case Posse who is looking into this matter through the auspices of Sheriff Arpaio’s office.  Dr. Corsi was there, and some other individuals were there as well.  And then, as a result of that meeting the Sheriff’s Department had a meeting with the Surprise Arizona Tea Party on March 31st.  And Mike Zullo very graphically showed how he recreated the postal cancellation stamp that appears on Mr. Obama’s Selective Service record.  And he said what he wound up doing was recreating the stamp in his living room.  And what the significance of that as Mr. Zullo put out is that although the birth certificate is a manufactured document, layer upon layer, the Selective Service record is more problematic because the law states unequivocally that if you do not register for the Selective Service, you are ineligible to hold public office.  And that came as a rather quiet moment, I would imagine, at the Surprise Arizona Tea Party meeting on the 31st of March.

BOYLES:  So, Barak Obama never lived and never worked in Connecticut?

SAMPSON:  Nobody can find any connection to Connecticut, whatsoever.

BOYLES:  Is there any reason on earth that you can understand on earth, in all the years you worked in that business, that his SSN start with the digits 042?

SAMPSON:  Oh-four-two is…. This is another anomaly that has just recently occurred.  Prior to June of 2011, the Social Security Administration would issue Social Security Numbers from their headquarters in Baltimore.  But the first three digits of the number is what is called the area number.  And that number was uniquely identified to and tied to the zip code from where the individual was applying for the number.  It’s not an indication of where they were born.  It’s not an indication of where they permanently reside.  It’s merely the … where they applied for the number from

BOYLES:  Sure.  You could be born in western Pennsylvania, but apply in Detroit and you have a …

SAMPSON:  … you could be born in Czechoslavakia and come to the United States and everything

BOYLES:  Exactly.

SAMPSON:  … and apply for a number in Connecticut, and you would have an 042 number.

BOYLES:  Exactly.

BOYLES:  We’ve been over this so many times on the air.  Well, in 1977, according to his timeline, his official biography, he is slinging ice cream at a Baskin Robbins.  When Mr. O’Reilly – “Mr. O”, used to be Mr. Reilly, said, “Oh, his father got it because he was at Harvard.”  Well, first of all, his father….

SAMPSON:  His father was in Massachusetts.

BOYLES:  That’s number one.  But number two, his father was back in Africa.

SAMPSON:  Well, this is true also.

BOYLES:  In 1977, he had returned to Kenya.  So, long story short, neither one of those are possible scenarios.

SAMPSON:  Correct.

BOYLES:  Is the one possible that Madeline Payne Dunham – “Toot”—picked it up somehow?

SAMPSON:  Either her or parties unknown.  You know, there’s been some rampant speculation that Bill Ayers and his wife, given their prior affiliation with the Weather Underground knew very well how to obtain counterfeit or false documents.

BOYLES:  Is there any way that anyone could ever see the Baskin Robbins records, to see if that number was when he was slinging ice cream?

SAMPSON:  Well, back in 1977 we didn’t have Form I-9, which is the employment eligibility.  So, I mean, that didn’t come into play until 1986.

BOYLES:  Where’s the … But what if you could see his Occidental college entrances?

SAMPSON:  That would be good.

BOYLES:  And then, I thought about this last night – then you could see whether 042 shows up in Occidental or Columbia or wherever.

SAMPSON:  Well, here’s the interesting thing.  You know, Ludwig dies in 1981.

BOYLES:  Right.  He dies in Hawaii.

SAMPSON:  Right.  And I am not in any way, shape, form, or manner saying that the number that Ludwig has is the same …

BOYLES:  No, I understand.

SAMPSON:  Okay.   However, the Selective Service record that also has that Social Security Number of 042-68-4425 was purportedly filed by Mr. Obama in 1980.  But then again, you know, Zullo has very convincingly shown me, and has shown a bunch of people either in presentations or behind closed doors how he recreated that postal cancellation stamp, and there are problems with it.  But, you know, we don’t know.  We simply don’t know. And that’s where it’s a little problematic.  At some point, hopefully, the truth is going to come out, and we’ll see what happens.

BOYLES:  Well, so, congratulations on being number five.  You certainly deserve more than that.

SAMPSON:  Well, you know, I’ll leave you to be number one.

BOYLES:  You know, Terry [Lakin] … I mean, every one of you guys… I mean, I’ve tried to make this point.  Sampson, Hollister, Wolf, Doc Lakin … All you guys risked a hell of lot more than I ever did.  I just get up at three o’clock in the morning and do a radio show.  But Terry lost everything.  Phil Wolf took an enormous amount of heat.  Hollister took huge heat.  You’ve taken heat.  And, you know, and, you guys, well, set aside.

SAMPSON:  Well, we swore an oath to defend the Constitution, Peter, and that’s where my core value is.

BOYLES:  Long story short, I’m… I mean, like Sheik was saying, you know, we’re number one, but… Truly, looking at you four guys, I don’t even belong on the list.  But…

SAMPSON:  Well,  you’ve been carrying the water, also.  I mean, you’ve been persistent covering this issue where others… where angel fear to tread… you know, it’s…

BOYLES:  It’s “Fools rush in.” [laughing]

SAMPSON:  Yeah.  Fools rush in.  But, you know the old Shakespearian proverb, you know, getting back to this article.  The quote that they’ve got in here as it relates to me is factually correct.

BOYLES:  Absolutely.

SAMPSON:  And no one’s disputing that.

BOYLES:  No, no one’s disputing anything.

SAMPSON:  I mean, you’re shooting the messenger because you don’t like the message.  I mean, it’s the old Shakespearian adage, “Me thinks the lady doth protest too much.”

BOYLES:  Well, that’s the game that the Post has been playing with this series of editorials. “Why Pal Around with Trump?”